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Tahun 3.kita separuh doktor.
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kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?)

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afnan fakhrurazi
naqiyan
6 posters

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26kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sat May 28, 2011 9:30 pm

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
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Pro Member

naqiyan wrote:tak faham. tak faham. hmmm....

apa maksud K leaves the cell in exchange for H from ECF?

ini part BARTTER,(ye masih di bartter lagi..huhu)

*kalau xde nk jawab xpe je,paham je semua tgh study... (-__-)

weh, alang2 ko dah study n dpt jwpan, share2 la kat cini jgak..mane tau bleh menmbhkan kefahaman org lain jgk..

27kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sat May 28, 2011 10:06 pm

ayunishafaf

ayunishafaf
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28kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sat May 28, 2011 11:28 pm

naqiyan

naqiyan
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Star Member

afnan fakhrurazi wrote:
naqiyan wrote:tak faham. tak faham. hmmm....

apa maksud K leaves the cell in exchange for H from ECF?

ini part BARTTER,(ye masih di bartter lagi..huhu)

*kalau xde nk jawab xpe je,paham je semua tgh study... (-__-)

ayat tu dia ckp sebab berlakunya alkalosis ( sebab dia letak bracket ) kan2?
rasenya gini j kot..kan loss of K = hypokalcemia kan?
so feedback dia nk increase balik K conc. tuh..
jadi cranya dgn take K from the cell ( K kan more intracellular )
jadi dia gunakan H/K atpase tranporter ( ada dia ckp dlm K handling tuh )
so, dia tukar la jadik H into the cell ( decreased dlm ECF )
tp K into the ECF ( decreased in the cell )

** sebenrnya ni hnyalah andaian semata2 sebab xd info yg lengkap n terperinci
** rasanya main point dia nk ckp metabolic alkalosis j kot kat citu
** dia mungkin confuse cikit dgn komen atas2 pasal aldosterone kan ? tp rasanya dua2 berlaku serentak

oooo...aku faham daaa sekarang...terima kasih byk2.. (^_^)

logic je teori ni,sbb nya,bila rujuk K handling kat m/s 61,

dia kata reabsorption of K kat DCT and collecting tubule tu guna H/K ATPase system,yang mana HANYA AKAN BERLAKU WHEN LOW K(K DEPLETION) i.e. seperti case bartter syndrome la kn..

so,thats y lah dia kata K leave the cells in exchange with the H fom ECF.

kalau kita confused dgn action aldosterone yg cause hypokalemia tu,sebenanrnya action aldosterone tu berlaku kat P cell of collecting duct,ikut Na/K exchange.

and at the same time sebenarnya berlaku jugak H/K exchange kat I cell.

bezanya,Na/K exchange tu aim dia nak increasekan semula Na dlm badan,dan H/K exchange tu nak increasekan K dalam badan.

hmmm...maaf kalau aku salah faham,mintak betulkan semula,tp setakat ni aku faham dah maksud kau bg ni afnan,tengs2!

http://www.manismasinhidupku.blogspot.com

29kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 3:53 am

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
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naqiyan wrote:
oooo...aku faham daaa sekarang...terima kasih byk2.. (^_^)

logic je teori ni,sbb nya,bila rujuk K handling kat m/s 61,

dia kata reabsorption of K kat DCT and collecting tubule tu guna H/K ATPase system,yang mana HANYA AKAN BERLAKU WHEN LOW K(K DEPLETION) i.e. seperti case bartter syndrome la kn..

so,thats y lah dia kata K leave the cells in exchange with the H fom ECF.

kalau kita confused dgn action aldosterone yg cause hypokalemia tu,sebenanrnya action aldosterone tu berlaku kat P cell of collecting duct,ikut Na/K exchange.

and at the same time sebenarnya berlaku jugak H/K exchange kat I cell.

bezanya,Na/K exchange tu aim dia nak increasekan semula Na dlm badan,dan H/K exchange tu nak increasekan K dalam badan.

hmmm...maaf kalau aku salah faham,mintak betulkan semula,tp setakat ni aku faham dah maksud kau bg ni afnan,tengs2!


* cer rujuk buku endocrine m/s 78.. kat citu dia ckp yg aldosterone jugak menyebabkan " H excretion by increasing the activity of H atpase activity at intercalated cell "
* mybe effect aldosterone tu ada jgk kat I cell..
*even ak pun pening jgk dgn menda alah ni..

30kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 3:59 am

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
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Pro Member

kalau aku ckp conclusion dia gini , ko agak2 btl x??

1- Na reabsorb dia exchange dgn K ( dekat Parietal cell )
2- when K tu kat luar, dia nk reabsorb jgk K ( K kan penting jgk )
3- K reabsorb with exchange H ( dekat intercalated cell )
4- resulting H loss in the urine
5- metabolic alkalosis

31kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 7:36 am

naqiyan

naqiyan
Star Member
Star Member

afnan fakhrurazi wrote:kalau aku ckp conclusion dia gini , ko agak2 btl x??

1- Na reabsorb dia exchange dgn K ( dekat Parietal cell )
2- when K tu kat luar, dia nk reabsorb jgk K ( K kan penting jgk )
3- K reabsorb with exchange H ( dekat intercalated cell )
4- resulting H loss in the urine
5- metabolic alkalosis

a'ah,sama lah dgn apa yg aku faham,haha,maaf lah,ayat aku kat atas mcm pening je..aku saja nak try hurai tp berbelit plak..

http://www.manismasinhidupku.blogspot.com

32kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 9:45 am

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
Pro Member
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naqiyan wrote:
a'ah,sama lah dgn apa yg aku faham,haha,maaf lah,ayat aku kat atas mcm pening je..aku saja nak try hurai tp berbelit plak..

hahaha..wes, bleh x tlg bgtau ap yg ko faham pasal alpha-gamma linkage dlm servo assistant function ( strecth reflex )

33kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 2:33 pm

ayunishafaf

ayunishafaf
Star Member
Star Member

knpe kn...
dlm osmotic diuresis...ms 59
'there is decrease in facultative n obligatory water reabsorption'
knpe decrease facultative r?
bukn facultative reabsorption depend on ADH ker?
kater ADH secretion normal or increase
cmner dye bleh kter decrease facultative?

34kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 6:04 pm

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
Pro Member
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ayunishafaf wrote:knpe kn...
dlm osmotic diuresis...ms 59
'there is decrease in facultative n obligatory water reabsorption'
knpe decrease facultative r?
bukn facultative reabsorption depend on ADH ker?
kater ADH secretion normal or increase
cmner dye bleh kter decrease facultative?


eh? topic pasal osmotic diuresis ada penah dipost dlm FB..
dia ckp water loss sebab dlm urine tu bnyak solute(eg glucose ) , so high osmotic pressure ( prevent h20 reabsorbtion )
ADH increased tu mybe sebagai feedback untuk increased water reabsorbtion tp xcukup untuk against factor yg dihasilkan oleh solute tuh..
so, kesimpulannya tetap decreased in both types of reabsorbtion..

35kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 6:21 pm

ayunishafaf

ayunishafaf
Star Member
Star Member

maksudnyer even ADH secretion is normal or even increase
tp still x efficient to rebsorp water sbb byk sgt solutes which retain water
tht's why decrease facultative reabsorption?
ek?

36kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Sun May 29, 2011 6:24 pm

afnan fakhrurazi

afnan fakhrurazi
Pro Member
Pro Member

ayunishafaf wrote:maksudnyer even ADH secretion is normal or even increase
tp still x efficient to rebsorp water sbb byk sgt solutes which retain water
tht's why decrease facultative reabsorption?
ek?

bak kata beit humaira' begitulah gamaknya.. kah2..

37kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Mon May 30, 2011 6:05 pm

drpetemd

drpetemd
Book Addicts
Book Addicts

ak pnh tnye soalan tu kt FB...rujuk2 lah fb...

kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Aw11

https://www.facebook.com/afiffahimmd

38kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) - Page 2 Empty Re: kidney (title pun kena ada length ke?) Tue May 31, 2011 1:01 am

nwahdaty91


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Book Lovers

naqiyan wrote:
afnan fakhrurazi wrote:
nwahdaty91 wrote:
afnan..kan naqiyan btaw dyer da bcer 7x pown xpaham2..means da khatam kidney 7 kli la tuh..Very Happy..
*xbcer agy kidney..xleh nk interfere...


yerla, memang dulu dia baca 7 kali..then yg ni dia baru bukak balik buku..sebab tu dia bru perasan yg topic ni dah di reply.. ak pun x baca menda gak ag..

woaaa..satu penghinaan di situ,aku baca BARTERR je 7 kali,haha,yang lain mana ada...

*wahdaty,tahniah,aku nampak ko da dapat satu bintang,USAHA LAGI yerr..kih kih kih =D

tengs naqiyan..
satgy ak wujud lagi dgn misi dan visi dpt 2 bntang lak..haha... Cool Cool Cool

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